Peter is a Keynote Speaker & Cross Fitter
Peter Montoya, keynote speaker and best-selling author, talks about how his passion for CrossFit provides balance in his life, helps him establish connections and relationships, and how it helped further him in his career!
• Getting into CrossFit
• How CrossFit translates to his career
• Establishing connections through CrossFit
• Adding balance into his life
• On the pedestal vs off the pedestal leaders
• How leadership development improved his business
• Peter’s formula to developing and empowering leaders
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Welcome to Episode 305 of What’s Your “And”? This is John Garrett. Each Wednesday, I interview a professional who, just like me, is known for a hobby or a passion or an interest outside of work. To put it another way, it’s encouraging people to find their “And.” Those things above and beyond your technical skills, the things that actually differentiate you when you’re in the office.
I’m so excited to let everyone know that my book’s being published very soon in like a month, and it’ll be available on Amazon and a few other websites, so check out whatsyourand.com for all the details. I can’t say how much it means that everyone’s listening to the show and changing the cultures where they work because of it. The book will really help to spread this message. Please don’t forget to subscribe so you don’t miss any of the future episodes.
I love sharing such interesting stories each and every week, and this week is no different with my guests, Peter Montoya. He’s a leadership strategist, speaker and author. Now, he’s with me here today. Peter, thanks so much for taking time to be with me on What’s Your “And”?
Peter: Oh, thank you, John. I’m thrilled to be here.
John: This is going to be so much fun. But before we get into it, I have 17 rapid fire questions. Get to know Peter on a new level —
Peter: I might get to know myself on a new level after 17 questions.
John: That’s a good point actually. That’s a good point. All right, I’ll start you out with an easy one then. How about a favorite color?
John: Blue, solid. Mine too. All right. How about a least favorite color?
John: Okay, fair enough. Fair enough. This is a tricky one. Cheese burger or pizza?
Peter: Oh, pizza. Yeah, definitely. Pepperoni pizza.
John: Really good pizza. Yeah. How about a favorite actor or actress?
Peter: Today, it’s Brad Pitt.
John: Oh, solid answer. Would you say you’re more of an early bird or a night owl?
Peter: Definitely early bird. My wife and I are in bed by 8:30 or 9:00.
John: Oh, wow. Okay. Okay. There you go. You live in California, but you’re on Eastern Time.
Peter: More or less.
John: That’s awesome. How about more pens or pencils?
Peter: Pens. All pens.
John: Pens. Solid. Okay. How about puzzles? Sudoku or crossword?
Peter: Sudoku. I love that. It’s really a lot of fun. I spent a lot of time — travelling on airplanes, I do it all the time.
John: Yeah, absolutely. How about more Star Wars or Star Trek?
Peter: Star Wars.
John: Yeah. Me too, man. I’m the same. How about computers, PC or Mac?
Peter: I grew up on a Mac, but now I’m a PC guy, but I still have an iPhone.
John: Oh, okay. All right. You’re still one foot over there. All right. All right. How about a favorite ice cream flavor? I’m a huge ice cream junkie.
Peter: Yeah, chocolate chip or chocolate chip cookie dough, either one of those.
John: Excellent choices. More planes, trains, or automobiles?
Peter: Oh, god. I’m a car fanatic. I’ve owned Cobras and Mustangs and Camaros. Right now, I’m on a Tesla. Yeah, I’m a car fanatic.
John: That’s awesome, man. That might be your new “And.” How about cats or dogs?
Peter: Dogs. They’re just simple but loving, just like men. We’re really easy to please.
John: Right. That’s an excellent point, man. That’s totally perfect. How about would you say a favorite movie of all time?
Peter: The Godfather I and II. I’ll put it into one answer.
John: Okay, okay, no, that works. How about more jeans or khakis?
Peter: Jeans. I think khakis are kind of like phony wear. It’s not that —
John: Right. It’s like either go casual or suit up like what are you? Down the middle? This is crazy. That’s hilarious. I love that. I totally love that. All right. How about a favorite number? Any number?
John: Okay, mine too. Is there a reason?
Peter: George Costanza used it a line in Seinfeld. He wanted to name her daughter Whistling Seven.
John: Right. Oh, man. That’s so perfect. The last one, the last one. Favorite thing you have or the favorite thing you own?
Peter: My iPhone. It really is pretty practical.
John: Yeah, yeah. And it’s such a part of our lives now. It’s crazy. That’s cool, man. Very cool. So let’s talk CrossFit. How did you get into it?
Peter: I think I got into it in 2012 when my then girlfriend, now wife, I met her, she was doing CrossFit. I was freshly divorced. I thought, well, I’m always looking for something new. When I grew up, I was a cross-country runner, then for a while, I bicycled and then swam. I never did triathlons, but I did each one of those individually. I think that kind of punishing mentality was already baked into my mind.
John: Right? Why do you hate yourself, Peter? This became an intervention all of a sudden. It’s interesting how you’ve done all of those activities growing up, and then just CrossFit feels like it’s a next level sort of a thing.
Peter: A lot of ways, it is. Actually, I have to go back to it and say the running I did in cross-country in high school, I ran 70 miles a week, it was ten to 14 miles a day, depending on the day, usually one day off, and it was really intense. I mean, you’re basically running six-minute miles all during workout, uphill, downhill, no matter where it was. I have ADHD. I think I heard the description for ADHD. We’re not so much masochistic. We like the push. I kind of like that idea of strain and pushing through and conquering. That mentality led me to other sports like that. I’m an A-type personality. I enjoy the struggle. I like having the mental discipline to be able to push through difficult circumstances.
John: Yeah, I guess with CrossFit, it’s different things each time sort of a thing?
Peter: Yeah, it is. CrossFit is the most fun you’ll ever have oftentimes not having fun. They call it a box. First of all, you go into a warehouse, and it’s very, very little equipment. Each workout is on the hour, usually before work or after work, and they usually have lunchtime classes too. You start with a quick warm up, stretching, and then you’ll do usually a strength exercise or maybe an endurance exercise, and then you’ll do what’s called the WOD, or the workout of the day.
You’ve got a coach who’s leading you, and you’re doing it as a group and everyone’s kind of doing the same exercise, the same program on the same day, and it’s rarely ever the same, so a workout of the day that you might do. In January, you might not repeat again for a year and a half, then you might come around and see it again, because some of them are replicated.
It’s very unique. You get stretching, gymnastics, you got an aerobics, which is either rowing or running or bicycling or jumping rope. You’ve got Olympic lifting. Everything you might have done in your life, you do it in a CrossFit box at some point in time. It’s very all purpose.
John: Yeah, that’s cool. It’s not all weights. Sometimes, it’s like giant tires, or who knows what type of thing. I mean, I’ve seen it when I walk by and go, “Wow, those people are crazy.” I just keep walking, and go get a milkshake. I’m the opposite. No, that sounds cool though because I mean, it mixes it up. It makes it fun and makes it interesting.
Peter: It really is. I mean, I cannot tell you how addictive CrossFit is, and there really is an adrenaline rush that you get with CrossFit that I gotten with no other sport, because there is a competitive angle for those who want it. When you have an A-type personality, you’re competing against yourself, you’re competing against the clock, and that drives you to want to do better each and every time, and then plus, there’s a camaraderie about it. Whenever you have mutual suffering with your friends, it is an incredible bonding experience. Things you hear about CrossFit, how do you know your friend does CrossFit? Because they won’t stop talking about it. That is definitely true.
John: That’s so true. That’s so true. That’s cool. Do you have one of the exercises, that’s one of your favorites, like when you walk in, and that’s the workout of the day? It’s like sweet.
Peter: I love the Olympic lifting which are clean and jerks. I love those. I love back squats. Then I always love running, so I’m still a runner. I like something we’re doing in the gym. We’re doing clean and jerks, and we’re maybe jumping rope and then we got to run out the door and run a half mile and come back. I like running out the door for some reason.
John: That’s a Peter day for sure.
Peter: Yeah, it is.
John: That’s awesome. Do you feel like CrossFit at all translates over to your work or even in what way, I guess?
Peter: I think grit is really an important skillset for life and especially for business executives. Grit is the ability to persevere when things are not going your way. It’s being able to have a loss or a setback and pick yourself back up and keep moving forward. It is, incrementally saying, I’m going to get better at this and applying yourself every single day no matter what, it’s the endurance. There is a mentality that goes into good CrossFitters. That also is very applicable for life as well. It becomes a pattern that you not only behave that way in the gym, you start behaving that way in life, which is kind of a positive, can-do mentality.
John: Right. I love that. I mean, it’s so perfect that it translates over because yeah, every day in the office is different. You have the workout of the day that you don’t know until you walk in the office, and you’re like, “Oh, yes. I guess we’re doing this one.” That’s exactly the same, and you have to persevere, you have to have that mental toughness. I love that parallel. That’s fantastic.
Peter: By and large, most CrossFitters are highly intelligent people. It’s really hard to find a dumb person doing CrossFit because it is so varied and takes so much mental discipline. Once you kind of get into the mentality of CrossFit, it really does a great job applying to life. It’s hard to find somebody who’s depressed or a loser or not going anywhere who does CrossFit.
John: That’s exactly why I don’t do CrossFit. I just figured it out. No, I’m just joking.
Peter: Oh, come on, John.
John: No, I’m just kidding. No, I’m joking, man. I’m joking. But you’re right. I mean because even if you feel that way going in after you do it repeatedly, then you’re going to not be that person anymore.
Peter: Oh, there’s an adrenaline rush. No matter how grouchy or how tired you go in there, you always leave with a little bit up.
John: That’s really cool, really cool. Is this something that you share with clients that you have now?
Peter: I certainly have tried. It doesn’t stick for everyone because it’s really intense. The other thing I will admit about CrossFit, if you are properly doing it and really doing it to where you will get injured. The only way to do CrossFit over a long period of time is really to moderate the weights and the intensity. Otherwise, you will have the strains and the pulls. That’s all there is to it about CrossFit.
John: Right. Yeah, just a lot of ice packs or buy a lot of frozen peas, like whatever it is.
Peter: More or less.
John: Yeah, yeah, that’s true. Even like in your prior corporate life was talking about the running or swimming or cycling, was that something that you did?
Peter: I don’t know if I’ve talked about my athletics as much before CrossFit, because CrossFit is so incredibly unique and fun. I can’t think of anybody has stuck with nearly as much as me.
John: I mean, it happens because I mean, it’s got to be for somebody, but when you talk about it, I mean, you’re just so animated and you light up and for other people, it might be binge watching Netflix. Okay, well, that’s your thing, then sharing that’s also cool.
Peter: Yeah, I have been living half the year this year up in Flagstaff and for people in Flagstaff, it’s the outdoors. People love hiking and skiing up there. You being in Denver, people love, absolutely adore being in the outdoors and exploring.
John: Yeah, for you, it’s getting in the box and then make it happen. No, no, no, but that’s super cool, man. That’s super cool. I would imagine that the people that also do CrossFit, when you come across them, I mean, there’s got to be magic that happens in that relationship, you’re best friends for no reason.
Peter: Yeah, because you have workouts you’ve done in common. They actually have names, men’s names and women’s names. They say, hey, have you ever done Fran before? What’s your Fran time, for example, you go, oh, I’ve done in three minutes. That’s awesome. You have these on automatic points of connection, because you have the same mutual experience of suffering together.
John: Right, right. Yeah. That’s really incredible, really incredible. Going back to the leadership in the grid, I guess, do you feel like there are certain skills that leaders have that they can essentially, maybe through CrossFit or through other hobbies and passions and interests, that maybe leaders can focus on that accidentally make them better at their job?
Peter: Yeah, I think my life motto is fall down seven, stand up eight. That certainly has been true in my business career as an entrepreneur and also true in my athletic career. I was the oldest of five boys and I was the least athletic of all of my brothers. I don’t actually have great coordination, but I was the only one who lettered in sports in high school. I have one other brother who’s still pretty athletic. It’s all been mental determination. The only reason I’ve been persevered in sports so much, and that really has led over to my business career as well. Bottom-line is that I just don’t give up. I just don’t stop.
John: Yeah, I mean, how much is it mental? I mean, is it really like 90% mental, 10% physical type of thing?
Peter: Yeah. Obviously, your physicality grows as you’re in CrossFit over time, but yeah, it’s all mental.
John: Yeah, yeah. And then I guess, just from a like a business leadership perspective, how much is it technical skills, physical, if you will, and how much is it mental of having the right attitude or having relatability or vulnerability, things like that?
Peter: Business world, good god. There’s so much you learn as a business owner and as a business leader, so there are so many careers you can do in life where the profession is not personal. If you are a carpenter and you’re hammering nails, you leave that day, downing yourself because how badly it went that day, if you’re a sales clerk, but if you were a speaker, like you and I are or if you’re a business leader, we’ve both left meetings or speeches, and we have to do personal reflection, and we’ll look at ourselves and how we actually performed. That’s tough.
John: Yeah, no, it’s very hard. It’s very hard.
Peter: Speaking and leadership and being a politician, these are all very personal businesses, which make them really tough.
John: It also, I guess, would make it tough to turn it off, if you will, to have something where it’s not just all work all the time, where having hobbies and passions, and CrossFit gives you something to at least go do. I would imagine that that benefits in that way as well.
Peter: Yeah, absolutely. You’ve got to have diversity in life. I’ve had times in my life where I’ve worked 70 hours a week, and all work and no play makes Peter very, very dull boy. It was, you know, very, very one-dimensional and what I could talk about and what I could do. There were times where I didn’t go to dinner. I didn’t watch movies, I didn’t see friends. I did nothing but work all the time.
John: Yeah. Because I mean, that’s what we think is the answer. I need another degree, I need another certification and I need to work more, and that’s not always the case.
Peter: Yeah. Early on, if you want success in this country, and you don’t come from money, unfortunately, it does require probably a decade of really obscene amount of work. It doesn’t lead to a lot of balance for about a decade, and then you can kind of get some balance back. But this country requires more or less three things for success – knowledge, relationship and capital. With any one, you can start getting the other two. I was raised more or less in a middle class neighborhood. My parents, when we were in college, they had gotten divorced. They didn’t have any money. I paid my own way through college, and then I had no money getting out.
I had a little bit of knowledge, a little bit of relationships, and then I worked 15 years like a dog before I had any kind of capital to mention.
John: But I love how one of them is relationships. I feel like relationships don’t always happen mostly in the work setting. I mean, it might happen there, but the relationship is because of nothing work related. Nowadays, it’s another CrossFitter or it was another swimmer and it was something that had nothing to do with what you were doing at work.
Peter: I’ve gotten very intentional in my older years, I’m 51 now, about building relationships. I think when you’re growing up, you just make friends because you’re in high school and college, there are people all around you, and you see them all the time and you’re doing things. But I’d be very, very intentional about it. I used to think there was a three-legged stool for health, and the three legged stool which I thought it was, which if you want to live a healthy life, I knew was sleep, eating right, and exercise, and it didn’t dawn on to me about five years ago, there’s actually a fourth leg to that stool of health. That fourth leg of the stool of health is actually social connection.
The research shows if you want to majorly reduce your level of anxiety, you want to increase your self-esteem and your self-confidence and your sense of authenticity, you need three to four hours a day of good empathetic connection with a human being. I’ve added that late in life. It really has paid dividends for me in my leadership, because now I’m able to connect more, I have more confidence, I’m more assured when I’m speaking to audiences or working with my team.
John: That’s so awesome. That empathetic social connection is not, look, I’m the smartest person in the room, and I know everything, just listen to what I have to say. It’s actually the opposite of that, which is hard for leaders to do to kind of admit that they maybe don’t know something or somebody else might have other ideas.
Peter: What you’re talking about there is what I call on the pedestal or off the pedestal leadership. On the pedestal of leaders, we don’t hopefully see them that often anymore, but they basically think they’re infallible, they’re perfect, they’re self-righteous, and they’re not open to suggestions. Basically, the directives are mostly given without any kind of questioning at all, unquestionable.
We see leaders like that. They really have got to have their act together. We see that a lot in professions like judges, attorneys, some politicians, some business leaders, doctors, not all police officers, but they have a very authoritarian —
John: Authoritative, yeah.
Peter: It’s a very difficult style of leadership to pull off because you really got to have your act together because people are looking to combat you. They’re looking to beat, to oppose you. On the other hand, you have off the pedestal leader, and that’s the kind of leader that I am. I’m very humble in that I know that I’m no more valuable than any other human on the planet.
I realize I am a million miles away from perfect and never will be perfect. I want to admit my mistakes or discover mistakes, preferably before I make them and apologize and correct them and move on. Whenever I’m speaking with an audience or working with a team, I will admit my mistakes, I will apologize, and I am no way putting myself on a pedestal like I’m better than anybody else.
John: I love that mentality of on the pedestal, off the pedestal. It’s such an easy visual for everyone listening to just don’t be that person. It’s that easy.
Peter: I’m sure you probably do the same thing too, John. Naturally, whenever I give a speech, I will almost always, in the first five minutes, share a short story or anecdote about a huge mistake I used to make.
I talk about my leadership when I first started off in business, and I spent 99% of my time in personal production, and I rarely came out of my office except to tell my team go charge a hill. I spent no time with my team, and my business never, ever got better than my own personal production. It wasn’t until years in that I started doing leadership development for all of my team. All of a sudden, I started getting exponential growth because I had a force multiplier with my people. That was a huge mistake that I made in my early days and leadership.
John: Yeah, I mean, I always start out with funny, and it’s all self-deprecating.
John: I’m really good at it. But that’s such a great example for leaders to not sit at their desk and shout out of the office, go charge to the hill and meet people where they’re at. Do you have any other quick tips for somebody listening that’s maybe a new manager type of level or just any type of person that has direct reports?
Peter: Leadership is really rapidly changing and evolving. Fifty years ago, when I was growing up, it was all top-down leadership. You had the top leaders who did the strategy, the vision, all of the thinking, and more or less all the edicts. The leader would go off into a cave somewhere, come up with a strategy, come back to the office and basically tell everyone what to do and do all the thinking for people in the organization.
More or less they rule by fear, intimidation, and bullying. But that only works when we were largely in agricultural and manufacturing business, because you want people to work really hard for a long period of time, so you basically scare them on a regular basis. Now, modern leadership when we’re actually more in technology and management, it’s all about innovation. If you want innovation, you’ve got to actually empower your people, and managing by fear does not work anymore.
The number one job of a leader 40 years ago was basically dictating, telling people what to do. The number one job of a leader today, actually, is leadership development. The number one job of a middle manager, top line manager, and every contributor to company is to develop their leadership skills. I’ve got a three-part formula to developing and empowering leaders.
John: What is it? Because you might as well. You can’t tease me like that, Peter. Come on.
Peter: The first one is to instill the mission and the purpose into every person in the organization, make sure they know exactly what their job is, what the organization’s job is, and also more importantly, why?
Simon Sinek’s book is Start With Why. Why are we doing this? This is really important. It’s got to be a why that matters to other people. If you’re thinking, well, I’m only working this job to put money in the table, that’s not a very good why. We are all hardwired to want to contribute and help other people. How is your job? How is your company making other people’s lives better? That’s the most important question you got to answer. That’s number one.
John: Yeah, I mean, because I remember when I worked corporate, people would report, I would always explain to them, well, here’s what you’re doing, but here’s how it fits into the big piece because here, take the spreadsheet and go cut up this data in whatever, well, why am I doing this? How does this matter? That’s such a huge step that a lot of people forget, because it takes five or 10 minutes, it’s not that much time, so just do that, so then people understand and then they’re more motivated to know, wow, what I’m doing fits into this big thing.
Peter: Absolutely right. Step two is instill and teach people the concept of absolute responsibility. Responsibility is about blame or shame. Responsibility is saying, okay, here’s what happened, who should we fire? Who should we chew out? Who should be shamed because they didn’t do the best job possible? I don’t spend a lot of time on that. What we believe in is absolute responsibility and absolute responsibilities, owning the situation, independent of who caused it, and then creating the outcome that you want.
John: As a leader.
Peter: As a leader, and also as — I don’t use the word employee, I use the word contributor. Even all of your team, your contributors also want to be instilled with the sense of absolute responsibility. That also means you got to widen the guardrails, so they can have more decision making authority, you want to give them as much decision making authority as possible.
One of the more famous stories is, and you probably have heard it, is of Nordstrom and more or less any clerk can make a decision to make a refund for any dollar amount up to I don’t know, a thousand dollars, something like that, no matter how damaged or worn the item might be right. That’s the authority they pushed down to their clerk level to make sure they were empowered. That’s step two.
Step three is competence and mastery. So you value their skill, whatever they might be doing – sales, marketing, accounting, whatever it might be, but also most importantly, in the area of decision making. As a leader, you always want to be walking people through the decisions that you make, be transparent about them, so they’re actually learning how think.
As you are working with your peers, and they come to you with a problem, rather than saying, well, here’s what I would do. You say, tell me what your thinking is. What’s the problem? You try to guide them by questions, rather than giving an answer. Whenever possible, if they come up with an answer that’s different than yours, you let them go with it. Every once in a while you let them fail.
John: Right. Because there’s a safety net.
Peter: When possible, not on big things, but on little things, you let them fail because oftentimes, they’ll find a new way of doing it. I’ve discovered that a lot in my business. Also, they actually feel empowered because they’ve been trusted. When they make a mistake, you don’t come back and rein them for making the mistake. You go, okay, what happened? What went right? What went wrong? What are you going to do better next time? That’s how you teach decision making.
John: Yeah, so pointing and laughing is not the appropriate response. But I love that. I mean, that’s so right, because you hired this person that’s highly educated and intelligent and an adult and you believe in them and then so many people end up getting treated like toddlers. It’s like, well, of course, we’re not engaged or don’t care type of a thing. Who knows? Maybe they have a better way or a great idea. Just because they don’t have a title that you deem necessary, doesn’t mean that they don’t have good ideas.
I love that. Yeah, because I mean, well, let’s see what happens. I mean who knows, you know, type of thing. That’s awesome, man. That’s so perfect.
Peter: The number one job of a leader is to do leadership development. It’s exactly what I said is to push these skillsets down to the bottom — I don’t want to say bottom. It sounds kind of hierarchical, but the people who are actually facing the problems as much as possible.
John: That’s so perfect. I love that. If people wanted to see more, or I know you have a book that’s coming out at some point in the near future, what’s your website so people know?
Peter: Well, I wrote books. My first book was called The Brand Called You on personal branding. I’m still taking my own advice. My website address is petermontoya.com.
John: Perfect. There you go.
Peter: Once I got there, I do a group mentoring program called the High Performance Organization. If you’re a business leader, and you want to instill these concepts of turning your business into a high performing organization, we provide you a system so you can actually implement these tools and techniques in your organization. We grow businesses by 25% to 50%, even during times of COVID.
John: Awesome, man. That’s so cool. That’s so cool. Before I wrap this up, sometimes, people like to ask me questions, the rapid fire type thing. We’ll make it the Peter Montoya show now. And you’re the host. Fire away.
Peter: All right, what’s your favorite book?
John: Favorite book. My favorite book is The War of Art by Steven Pressfield. It’s a book mostly for creatives about creating this giant masterpiece, but there’s things that get in your way that try to prevent you from resistance is the name that he gives it. Resistance’s whole entire goal is to make you never create this Sistine Chapel masterpiece, if you will. I really like that book. It’s also a quick read. It’s not, you know, I know everything and your stupid type of book.
Peter: Awesome. Love that. All right. What are some handful of your favorite podcasts?
John: Oh, you know, despite having a podcast with over 400 episodes, I do not listen to any. I really don’t. It’s hard to explain to some people but you’re either a creator or a consumer. I’m more of a creator making music videos and things like that. I don’t know, maybe I should. I don’t know. This one might be better if I did.
Peter: What are some of your favorite movies? Want to hear a drama, an action movie, and a comedy?
John: Okay, yeah. So Dumb and Dumber, for sure, and Ace Ventura I, for sure. Good Will Hunting, that’s a great movie. I guess action movie, I’m not like a huge action movie kind of guy.
Peter: I watched Rambo again. It was came out when we were kids. It’s still good. It is still a really good movie.
John: That’s what’s hard, because like Stripes. I went and watched it again. I’m like, I don’t know if it’s as funny. I don’t know like Ghostbusters, hilarious. That’s a great movie too. I think action, I think that counts. I don’t know. I mean just the creative minds behind that movie were just genius.
Peter: How do you sabotage yourself?
John: Oh, the inner critic is fierce, the imposter complex is larger than life. I’m just very critical of things that I do, things that I create, things that I make, because I want it to be really, really great because I just want to make something even when I’m on stage, when I’m speaking, I want to be a person that I would want to sit in the audience and watch.
I hold myself to higher standards, then you know, done is better than perfect. I really need to remind myself of that a lot. It’s just understanding that what I do is good and a lot of people appreciate it and it impacts a lot of people and just reminding myself of that is definitely giving myself some forgiveness, I guess is good.
Peter: Good. I like that. What did you do to cause the demise of your parents’ love for each other and their marriage?
John: I think just being born. I don’t know. Just being alive. Just kidding.
Peter: That was a joke. I was kidding. Please, don’t —
John: I know. That’s hilarious. Yeah, just being alive. That’s pretty much it. This has been so much fun, Peter. Thanks so much for taking time to be with me on What’s Your “And”?
Peter: That was a blast. Thank you so much for playihng with me today, John. I really enjoyed it.
John: Awesome. Everyone, if you want to see some pictures of Peter in action, or maybe connect with him on social media or his website, be sure to go to whatsyourand.com. All the links are there. While you’re on the page, please click that big button and do the anonymous research survey about corporate culture.
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